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Ask Slashdot: Can Star Wars Episode VII Be Saved?

Soulskill posted about 6 months ago | from the i-find-your-lack-of-faith-quite-understandable-actually dept.

Star Wars Prequels 403

An anonymous reader writes "10 years ago today, in the wake of two disappointing Star Wars prequels, we discussed whether Episode III could salvage itself or the series. Now, as production is underway on Episode VII under the care of Disney, I was wondering the same thing: can it return Star Wars to its former glory? On one hand, many critics of the prequels have gotten what they wanted — George Lucas has a reduced role in the production of Episode VII. Critically, he didn't write the screenplay, which goes a long way toward avoiding the incredibly awkward dialogue of the prequels. On the other hand, they're actively breaking with the expanded universe canon, and the series is now under the stewardship of J.J. Abrams. His treatment of the Star Trek reboot garnered lots of praise and lots of criticism — but his directorial style is arguably more suited to Star Wars anyway. What do you think? What can they do with Episode VII to put the series back on track?"

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Star Wars Sucks! (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050333)

The movies are all terrible. The only one that is half way decent is the Empire and that because Lucas neither wrote nor directed it. The more this new one completely ignores everything that came before it the better.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (1)

Penguinisto (415985) | about 6 months ago | (#47050397)

IMHO, the sucky part is that unless the story arc skips ahead as many years, the by-now old/wrinkle-bound actors are going to look really out of place...

(then again, in the interests of honesty, I never read eps 7-9, so...)

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050429)

we discussed whether Episode III could salvage itself or the series.

In addition to being shitty movies, the 3 "prequels" were doomed to failure before they were ever made. This is because you already know how everything has to turn out. Anakin Skywalker has two children who he hides and then becomes Darth Vader, Senator whats-his-name becomes "Emperor", the "clone army" become Imperial Storm Troopers, etc. etc. etc. All completely pointless.

And now that the original cast is all a hundred years old they want to make a new movoe with them. That'll work out well.

painted into a corner... (2)

jpellino (202698) | about 6 months ago | (#47050893)

Yup. He painted himself into a corner by releasing them as 4,5,6,1,2,3. But that need not be a problem. There are plenty of times when we know what's going to happen - such as with any movie based on a book - LOTR, Harry Potter, GoT... so what's a director / producer to do? MAKE US CARE. Use actors that we want to watch just because they are such great artists. He had decent actors at his disposal - he did well with Liam Neeson, less so with Ewan McGregor (see Life Less Ordinary or Trainspotting if you're not sure how good he can be.) He had Natalie Freaking Portman. This is the actress who chewed up the scenery in The Professional. She looked by Ep3 like she was the greenest member of a high school drama cast. I cared what happened to people in 4,5,6. What held me through 1,2,3 was the whizzy parts, the arc of the story, and the four-parallel story technique that was actually done so well you don't really notice it.

I think Abrams can salvage it and make it thrive. He may not follow the canon, but hey - it's story telling. Did you ever hear a story told the same way forever? We can all excuse The Kessel Run if it gives us Ep4, right? Same here. Heck, I'll spot him JarJar if he makes a movie that I want to turn right around in the lobby and watch again - like he did with Star Trek.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (1)

Cinder6 (894572) | about 6 months ago | (#47051019)

I disagree that knowing the gist of events prior to the original trilogy doomed the prequel trilogy before it even began. Sure, we knew, in broad strokes, what happened, but not how it happened. Beyond that, studies have shown that people actually tend to prefer a creative work if they've had the ending spoiled for them.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050615)

The movies are all terrible. The only one that is half way decent is the Empire and that because Lucas neither wrote nor directed it. The more this new one completely ignores everything that came before it the better.

Actually the only good one is Star Wars. Self contained no nonsense good guy versus evil guy. A princess, a farmboy and an adventurer. What more could you want ?

From the first sequel onwards it all came crashing down. Yeah Empire is more sofisticated than Star Wars but a better film ?
Nope. And ROTJ will having a good part in it (redemption of Vader) is just anahilated by all the other things (teddy bears waging wars against shock troopers, and the whole crazy part in Jabba the Hutt's palace).

As for the prequels, lets not even touch the subject. Had JJB and midiclorians not been there APM could have turned out to be an enjoyable movie. But the second and third films are just huge trainwrecks and no amount of fan editing will ever be able to fix them.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (5, Insightful)

plover (150551) | about 6 months ago | (#47050859)

The original Star Wars movies were great because we saw them when we were 13 years old, and they were filmed to appeal to 13 year olds. Watch it again now, and if you enjoy it that's likely due to fond memories of watching them as a child, not because they're such great pieces of filmmaking on their own.

Any remake is doomed if you expect a remake. It's also doomed if you expect to be transformed back into a 13 year old while watching the movie. All Star Wars movies are children's movies, aimed at their eras 13-year-olds. All of us adults who imagined they would be anything different were disappointed.

If you instead expect a movie that will entertain you, set in or near the original universe (but with modern filmmaking techniques and different characters,) you might put yourself in a position to enjoy it. But you'll probably enjoy it most if you bring your own child to the movie.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050983)

The original Star Wars movies were great because we saw them when we were 13 years old, and they were filmed to appeal to 13 year olds. Watch it again now, and if you enjoy it that's likely due to fond memories of watching them as a child, not because they're such great pieces of filmmaking on their own.

I was almost 6 years old when I saw Star Wars at the theater. Couldn't understand a thing but the visuals and music certainly impressed me. You're right that the Star Wars movies were never oscar storytelling material. But even now for all the film's campiness you can still enjoy it.

Any remake is doomed if you expect a remake. It's also doomed if you expect to be transformed back into a 13 year old while watching the movie. All Star Wars movies are children's movies, aimed at their eras 13-year-olds. All of us adults who imagined they would be anything different were disappointed.

If you instead expect a movie that will entertain you, set in or near the original universe (but with modern filmmaking techniques and different characters,) you might put yourself in a position to enjoy it. But you'll probably enjoy it most if you bring your own child to the movie.

I think part of the problem is that Lucas tried to appeal to 2 demographics at the same time. The kids of today (well of the '00) and the grown ups that were kids when the first trilogy appeared. It just didn't work out. Grownups wanted to see the backstory to their childhood favorite good/evil characters told in a reasonable adult fashion while the kids wanted to just enjoy a film (hence JJB and all the jokes about poops...). Two completely different objectives pulling the film (and new trilogy) in 2 opposite directions. Is it obvious that it all ended up in a giant clusterfuck ?

I have no idea wether Disney will manage to get a good film out of SW. What I do know is that I'm not in their demographics anymore so I'll stay home and when I get some SW nostalgia I'll just put the dvd in the player or read the fantastic accounts of the first trilogy production told in (the art of series books).

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47051049)

The original Star Wars movies were great because we saw them when we were 13 years old, and they were filmed to appeal to 13 year olds. Watch it again now, and if you enjoy it that's likely due to fond memories of watching them as a child, not because they're such great pieces of filmmaking on their own.

I was almost 6 years old when I saw Star Wars at the theater. Couldn't understand a thing but the visuals and music certainly impressed me. You're right that the Star Wars movies were never oscar storytelling material. But even now for all the film's campiness you can still enjoy it.

Try re-watching Transformer Gen 1 cartoons, especially the later seasons with the tripticons and such. The voices change (Iron hide vs Starscream) there are 4 iron hides in one scene, colors changing, the wrong bot's mouth moving. Bad bad QC. the music is recycled between that, and GI Joe, etc.

The DnD cartoon hung up remarkably well by comparison, FWIW, even if Buddy Aimes literally phoned in his lines from a phonebooth at times.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050919)

The first one had some simplicity about it. At the time, a sequel wasn't planned, so the princess wasn't related to the farmboy, the evil guy in the gas mask was just that... a figure to be feared. You were not having to think about events in other films or the Expanded Universe... the first film (before it was renamed to Episode 4: ANH) stood completely alone, like none of the others in the series could. The farm boy who has the mystic powers and brings down one of the mightiest objects in fictional history [1].

ESB was good for its time. The bad guys were back and were not going to allow the loss to end their reign. ROTJ... I'll stay with the same opinion from the reviewer who said pretty much the same thing in 1983: Too much Ewok, too little main cast.

Episodes 1-3 were OK, but they stood in the shadow of 4-6 since the plot was pretty much well laid down.

In a way, episode 7 is breaking fresh ground. No prequel, the ability to move past the original characters, the fact that Expanded Universe can be tossed aside. Almost anything can be done. I just fear that instead of them making another Episode 4 or 5 where the evil was evil (and not grey/bland "misunderstood" types like most movies) and the heroes were the true good guys... not just the guys who won the firefights.

Disney isn't dumb. I'm just crossing fingers that they can take the creative liberty with the strongest sci fantasy universe out there and break ground.

[1]: Nowadays, most anime have weapons along the lines of "don't aim that at my local galaxy cluster", or the soliton wave universe destroyer from later Star Treks, but the DS at its time was pretty bad-ass.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47051001)

The first one had some simplicity about it. At the time, a sequel wasn't planned, so the princess wasn't related to the farmboy, the evil guy in the gas mask was just that... a figure to be feared.

Malcolm Tucker: It's time for you to step up Ollie. What's that film that you love?
Ollie Reeder: What film?
Malcolm: The one about the fucking hairdresser, the space hairdresser and the cowboy. The guy, he's got a tin foil pal and a pedal bin. His father's a robot and he's fucking fucked his sister. Lego! They're all made of fucking lego.
Ollie: Star Wars?
Malcolm: That's the one. It's like that, where you kill all the bad guys, and you'll be able to blow up the big...
Ollie: Death Star.
Malcolm: The Death Star thing. Then you can go and live happily ever after on the planet with the teddy bears.
Ollie: They're Ewoks.

Re:Star Wars Sucks! (2, Insightful)

gl4ss (559668) | about 6 months ago | (#47050639)

and apparently lucas has nothing to do with this so...

however. abrams is shit. he is just shit. star trek into darkness is just so shit. in the next star wars, han solo will be making a phone call to alternate(expanded) universe han solo to warn him that jar jar binks is going to screw him over in the _past_. makes sense? well, as much sense as any shit mr abrams puts in his movies.

Lens flares (3, Insightful)

MouseR (3264) | about 6 months ago | (#47050335)

...better be absent.

Re:Lens flares (3, Informative)

dunezone (899268) | about 6 months ago | (#47050619)

In the Star Trek DVD commentary they(director and producer) even talk about how they overdid the lens flares. For the sequel they still had them but it wasn't as prevalent as the first. Its fine if you have like a single shot with it in there but not everything needs a flare.

Re:Lens flares (2)

Kozar_The_Malignant (738483) | about 6 months ago | (#47050903)

I always figured lens flares were the result of bad setup and shot planning. Maybe if you have four or five Oscars for cinematography you could get away with one or two as artistic license. Absent that, it just makes it look like you don't know what you're doing.

Re:Lens flares (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050973)

They cast a white-guy to play Kahn. Unforgivable.

Re:Lens flares (1)

lgw (121541) | about 6 months ago | (#47050635)

Lens flares will be the good part. While Abrams will fuck canon sideways with a catus, I'm sure the film will be fast-paced and entertaining. Everything that was wrong, style-wise, for a Star Trek film will be right for a Star Wars film. Pointless running through hallways, action-central plots that don't really make much sense, lots of laser gunplay, the bad guys in a bigger, more-armed ship with sinister lighting -- all of it will be great.

I'm fully prepared to treat it like the prequel movies: high-budget fanfiction works. But these should actually be good!

Re:Lens flares (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050773)

Ugh - bad memories. Could just imagine what he would do to the Lensman series. Lens flare on every shot that has a Lens?

Re:Lens flares (1)

Jmc23 (2353706) | about 6 months ago | (#47050797)

and replaced with ccd blooms...

Re:Lens flares (1)

AmiMoJo (196126) | about 6 months ago | (#47050817)

And wipes. They were cool in the 80s.

Yes. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050349)

My backpack has jets.

Re:Yes. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050469)

"My hovercraft is full of eels"

Re:Yes. (1)

Mordok-DestroyerOfWo (1000167) | about 6 months ago | (#47050779)

If they cast M.C. Chris as anything, I'd probably go on opening night.

frist psot (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050355)

because

You know... (5, Insightful)

The Good Reverend (84440) | about 6 months ago | (#47050357)

...it's hardly even started filming yet. Maybe wait until it's released to worry?

Or better yet, don't worry. Skip it entirely if you can't hold "sequel" and "rose-tinted memories of the originals" in your brain at the same time. No one's ruining your childhood if you just stay home...

Re:You know... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050445)

Honestly, when i heard they weren't going to follow the expanded universe, I decided to go ahead and see it. My worry was they were to attempt to turn fanfiction into a movie and I was planning to stay away from that shit.

Re:You know... (-1, Troll)

bluefoxlucid (723572) | about 6 months ago | (#47050549)

It's not even that. Look at that quotes list. Awkward quote #1? Just Jar-Jar being Jar-Jar. That was an appropriate quote for the character and context. Quote #5 was a neutral way to avoid an awkward silence. #7 was Anakin being a 9-year-old boy--yes, 9-year-old boys say awkward stupid shit like this. Quotes #20 and #34 were frighteningly insightful: this is exactly what happened after 9/11.

Prequel complainers are just full of shit. They cry about movies that are roughly as good as the originals.

Re:You know... (3, Insightful)

thedonger (1317951) | about 6 months ago | (#47050719)

It's not even that. Look at that quotes list. Awkward quote #1? Just Jar-Jar being Jar-Jar. That was an appropriate quote for the character and context. Quote #5 was a neutral way to avoid an awkward silence. #7 was Anakin being a 9-year-old boy--yes, 9-year-old boys say awkward stupid shit like this. Quotes #20 and #34 were frighteningly insightful: this is exactly what happened after 9/11.

Prequel complainers are just full of shit. They cry about movies that are roughly as good as the originals.

The prequels sucked because they tried to cram foreshadowing into every scene, as if we needed every single event in the prequels to relate to a specific event in the original 3. Then after the second prequel they realized they left so much undone that the third was just two hours of screen wipe-divided vignettes, and right at the end they were like, Oh shit, Anakin only has the one fake hand. So 5 minutes, one ill-constructed fight sequence, and single slashing of a light saber and suddenly he is Darth Vader in all his shiny, black awesomeness. Crap. Crap. Crap.

Re:You know... (1)

thedonger (1317951) | about 6 months ago | (#47050771)

Prequel complainers are just full of shit. They cry about movies that are roughly as good as the originals.

Also, anyone who compares Ewoks and Jar-Jar is a moron. The Ewoks actually fought, using old but useful weapons to help defeat the imperial forces. Jar-Jar was running away like a coward and accidentally destroyed an invading force in the process. Both character types aimed at kids? Sure. But they were nothing alike.

The problem with the "Prequels" wa (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050767)

s that it wasn't intended to give the same experience as IV, V, and VI. The prequels were aimed at a larger audience, and of course could not stand up to the dissecting lens that geek-dom uses to rip apart said movies. In terms of of what it was supposed to do, the Prequels made more money than the original three, so using "voting with your wallet" metrics, they are better movies [wikipedia.org] (wikipedia).

Now, I'm not saying that they ARE better, but the intention was not to create a "cult" movie, the intention was to spend money making a block-buster, that appeals to all sorts of viewers, in all age groups.

Oh, and another thin: awkward dialogue... yea, there are bad lines in the Prequels, but noting remotely resembling the list in that blog... and not in that order, not by far! ("You don't want to sell me death sticks"). Great way to display the Jedi mind trick, on the unsuspecting, weak-willed citizenry.

My assumption is that this movie doesn't need saving... it will do what its designed to do: Bring in expensive talent, and create a movie that the masses will enjoy. It even has many from the original cast coming on board to give it MORE marketing hype, more legacy milking, and more affiliation with the franchise than ever. Disney will make their investment back, by far.

No (5, Insightful)

tsa (15680) | about 6 months ago | (#47050365)

No, it can not return SW to its former glory. That is because the three SW films that came out first have got their cult status over the last 30 years. You can't just 'make' that.

Re:No (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050501)

Star Wars hasn't been its former glory since half way through episode VI

Re:No (5, Insightful)

MozeeToby (1163751) | about 6 months ago | (#47050533)

Nothing you say is wrong but what you imply is.

The prequels were fundamentally broken. Episodes 4-6 achieved cult status because they were enjoyable the first time around (not to mention the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th). The prequels released stand alone, not as part of the already established series, would have been laughed out of the theater. It's not rose colored glasses, there is a large and irrefutable quality gap between the original trilogy and the prequels.

Re:No (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050819)

I don't understand what everyone is bitching about. Episodes "original" 4 - 6 were campy and fun. Episodes 1 - 3 were pretty good. Anyone who didn't enjoy them as what they were was probably expecting too much. Just watch and enjoy it. Some aliens may be annoying - just like Jar Jar. Some may sound Japanese - like the trade federation. Who cares? Star Wars was never good "cinema". It was entertaining. It isn't literature. It is fun sci-fi. Love it for what it is or don't. But jeez, all the complainers seem to think that 4 - 6 were some sort of offering from god. They weren't.

Re:No (1)

sjames (1099) | about 6 months ago | (#47051069)

The problem is that they saw IV as a child. It was epic in a way things can only be epic to a child. No adult viewing of the prequels could possibly live up to that.

Beyond that, in 1977 it was new. The effects were leaps and bounds beyond the last action sci-fi flick. Even the theater technology was just upgraded (remember when 'in 35mm' was a thing?).

Based on toys, It looks like the kids now reacted to the prequels about the way we reacted to IV-VI.

Re:No (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050997)

Ask a 14 year old what series is better 4-6 or 1-3. They will almost all tell you 1-3 are great and 4-6 are boring, lack shine and polish and look fake.

It all depends on your perspective. As a person who saw Star Wars first run in theaters I don't hate the prequels. Could they have been better? Damn skippy! But I watched them with my kids and saw them have a similar reaction as I did when I saw 4-6 in the theaters with my parents.

I'm hoping for a great JJ Abrams lead star wars series. But I'm a fan of Star Wars in general, and will probably enjoy whatever is produced, because I can see the movies as a part of a universe I love. They may be nothing but polished turds, but I can find the joy in them.

Re:No (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050705)

No, it can not return SW to its former glory. That is because the three SW films that came out first have got their cult status over the last 30 years. You can't just 'make' that.

So on your planet, Star Wars got all of its Academy Awards 30 years later? On our planet, Star Wars was an instant sensation. But, oddly, on our planet, you can't watch Star Wars without a VCR.

Re:No (1)

NotDrWho (3543773) | about 6 months ago | (#47050791)

Plus, it's Disney. They're not going to take any chances. So expect safe, bland, middle of the road writing combined with lots of CGI action setpieces for the trailers--all carefully test-marketed to within an inch of the producers' lives.

It's produced by the king studio of all that is mediocre, and directed by the Ron Howard of his generation. Are you expecting fucking Stanley Kubrick here?

Re:No (1)

fermion (181285) | about 6 months ago | (#47050891)

When people tell me they have seen Star Wars(no episode number), and they are too young to have seen it originally in theaters, I ask if they have seen it on VHS. If the answer is no, then they have not seen Star Wars. That is because instead of leaving it as a static piece of culture, like Casablanca, Rocky Horror Picture Show, or Go, with all the warts and other defects, Lucas has managed and 'fixed' it to attract new audiences. Instead of letting the sequels get the new audiences, he very proactively retconned the films. And this is why Star Wars can't be saved. I am sure the new films will make a lot of money. I am sure that many will enjoy it. But unlike Star Trek, which may yet bounce back from Abrams sticky fingers, Star Wars does not have anything resembling such a solid base.

Get Serious! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050381)

Currently the IP has been pwn3d by Sith Lord Disney. Obviously the Force was not with us.

It's Not Possible (1)

avandesande (143899) | about 6 months ago | (#47050411)

Unless they put something in your drink to reduce your intellectual and emotional capacity to that of a 10 year old you are not going to like it.

Re:It's Not Possible (2)

Kozar_The_Malignant (738483) | about 6 months ago | (#47050933)

The theatre I frequent serves alcoholic beverages. This may help.

I remember... (3, Funny)

TWX (665546) | about 6 months ago | (#47050413)

...when the Star Wars fans were laughing at the situation with Abrams and the Star Trek movies that he made...

I've noticed that they're rather quiet now...

Re:I remember... (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | about 6 months ago | (#47050621)

They're the ones who have to deal with frickin' Jar Jar Binks. The worst we have is... Tribbles?

Lots and lots of Tribbles.

Re:I remember... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050873)

Tribbles are awesome.

Jar Jar is more akin to Space Hippies [wikipedia.org] .

Dead cat bounce (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050427)

It's gotta be better than Episodes I, II, and III.

Does anyone care anymore? (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050439)

Our childhood memories have been raped six ways to Sunday, but does anyone care anymore? Yes, stupid remakes of the movies we grew up with exist. The songs of our youth have been remade into cheap dance tunes and ringtones. The games we played are now free-to-play tablet apps with in-app purchases. The originals all still exist, should we need them - but do we need them? How long can you hang on to the past without becoming old instead of grown-up? I just wish they would spare the actors the embarrassment.

make people actually care for the characters (4, Interesting)

stewsters (1406737) | about 6 months ago | (#47050449)

Making it a bit darker in a gritty way would be nice. More character development. I saw this [imgur.com] on reddit today, and I kind of agree with where that's going.

Re:make people actually care for the characters (1)

vux984 (928602) | about 6 months ago | (#47050737)

Making it a bit darker in a gritty way would be nice

Because god forbid anything be bright or light-hearted.

Gritty and dark is always better? And everyone has to wear black, or really dark grey. Or maybe dark brown, but it has to be dark enough that it looks black. And everyone has to be a miserable tortured soul. That's a sure sign that its 'good'. Its like AAA FPS development right? Because all those need to be good is more grit and darkness with each iteration.

From the link you posted...

"Maybe kind of like a Star Wars version of Shepard from Mass Effect."

Yeah! Make it like Mass Effect! That ended well right? /sarcasm

More character development

Agree. Make a compelling movie.

Re:make people actually care for the characters (1)

stewsters (1406737) | about 6 months ago | (#47050993)

Because god forbid anything be bright or light-hearted.

Fine, you can put JarJar in there, but at least make me care for him this time.

Gritty and dark is always better? And everyone has to wear black, or really dark grey. Or maybe dark brown, but it has to be dark enough that it looks black.

You can do gritty without it being dark. Its more of a roughness of the area. Think Hoth, that is gritty and white.

Yeah! Make it like Mass Effect! That ended well right? /sarcasm

I liked the mass effect more than I did the Star Wars prequels. Yeah, the star child ending was weird, but that was the part that wasn't gritty. The issue people had with it was that the premise of the series is that you make choices that matter, and it didn't really.

Re:make people actually care for the characters (1)

kruach aum (1934852) | about 6 months ago | (#47050777)

That story doesn't need to be set in Space, require aliens, Jedi, Sith or the Force, and is told literally every day on the news.

Re:make people actually care for the characters (1)

stewsters (1406737) | about 6 months ago | (#47050883)

I would like a story that doesn't need funny aliens to carry itself. The original stories were basically samurai westerns. The space part was thrown in.

What is this? (-1, Troll)

fustakrakich (1673220) | about 6 months ago | (#47050459)

Has Slashdot become part of Disney's promotional department? It's worse than election season. Is it really a bad thing if we aren't constantly reminded of the damn Star Wars sequels?

What "other hand" (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | about 6 months ago | (#47050473)

Hey, I liked reading a lot of the extended universe stuff.

But as much as I enjoyed that, I'm not sure much of it would make for a great movie. At least not the parts they are thinking about now.

And the Extended Universe has a lot of weight to it by now. It's also pretty piled on, not leaving a lot of room for creativity...

I think a fresh start for Star Wars is a great thing, using the originals as a base. To me that offers the most excitement, a good story re-thought by people new to the universe.

So, I'm pretty excited about that aspect of the movie, that it is removed from a lot of chains and story expectations.

It's hopeless. (2)

Grishnakh (216268) | about 6 months ago | (#47050495)

Stick a fork in it, it's done.

Seriously, this isn't going to turn out well. For one thing, they got JJ "Lensflare" Abrams to do it, and he'll probably have the protagonists all be teenagers.

But even if they had a good director, they can't just undo the Prequels. They're already out there, and they've already ruined Star Wars. The only conceivable way to fix this is to not do Episode VII yet, but to go backwards and redo the Prequels, and pretend the old ones didn't happen. They're obviously not going to do that.

What's more, even if you ignore the crappy Prequels, Episodes IV-VI are quite old now, and are a product of a different time, and being sci-fi, would not ever pass as modern sci-fi movies.

Re:It's hopeless. (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | about 6 months ago | (#47050655)

...they can't just undo the Prequels. They're already out there, and they've already ruined Star Wars.

Oh really? [yimg.com]

Granted, Star Wars isn't Star Trek, but I'd prefer that scenario than see 1/24 of a second of Jar Jar Binks ever again.

Re:It's hopeless. (1)

SeaFox (739806) | about 6 months ago | (#47050975)

Stick a fork in it, it's done.

Seriously, this isn't going to turn out well. For one thing, they got JJ "Lensflare" Abrams to do it, and he'll probably have the protagonists all be teenagers.

Unlike the original series, where Luke and Leia were adults and Han Solo sported a walking stick with a hidden blaster.

Jar Jar for President! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050535)

What can they do with Episode VII to put the series back on track?"

Start the movie with a beheading of Jar Jar of course.

Begging the question (-1, Troll)

Spyrus (633357) | about 6 months ago | (#47050565)

The whole saga was intended as a pulpy, schlocky pastiche of Flash Gordon serials. It succeeds at this. There is no "former glory" for it to attain. You're thirty years older and you think it's cool to bag on the prequels, but you haven't watched Return of the Jedi (any version) lately. Ever wonder why none of the Star Wars movies won any awards other than for effects and music? There's your answer.

Re:Begging the question (1)

jedidiah (1196) | about 6 months ago | (#47050861)

Nope. The original trilogy managed to appeal to a wide swath of the population. It managed to be a cultural phenomenon with a scope so massive it's hard to relate to unless you actually lived through it.

The prequels tried to pander to small children and failed.

The originals treated the idea of being a Flash Gordon knockoff seriously. The prequels not so much.

Much like some Trek suffers from too much Roddenberry, Star Wars suffers from the same effect. An artist that built a success on his vision as distorted by collaborators creates a big steaming pile because no one is willing to say WTF.

No (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050571)

Sorry. Jar Jar Abrams is probably going to make worse movies than Eps 1-3.

Midi-chlorians begone! (4, Interesting)

juanca (49302) | about 6 months ago | (#47050583)

SW EP VII, Scene 1

Leia: Luke, after studying for years the effect of Midi-chlorians in the way we use the Force, I've come to the conclusion that they bare no effect in who can or cannot become a Jedi, all we know about them is wrong...anybody can be a Jedi...

Luke: whoa!

Re:Midi-chlorians begone! (2)

kruach aum (1934852) | about 6 months ago | (#47050703)

If anyone can become a jedi, why are jedi special? Their restrictive moral code? The universe would be filled with light-saber wielding telekinetic lunatics of all it took was wanting it hard enough.

Re:Midi-chlorians begone! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47051007)

two words: Midichlorian Transplants.

Aw yisssss~!

Re:Midi-chlorians begone! (1)

aicrules (819392) | about 6 months ago | (#47050943)

...by injecting promicin? Or by being injected by whatever Dr Suresh Mohindar developed? Or ....

Rocky V (2)

Lucas123 (935744) | about 6 months ago | (#47050591)

Another Star Wars sequel shouldn't be made in the first place. You can only take a movie story line so far and then you're just milking nostalgia for the sake of box office returns with no art or soul. The first three movies were perfection. Enough already.

Worried I am not (2)

portwojc (201398) | about 6 months ago | (#47050613)

If Disney knows how to do anything it's to take the work of others and run with it.

Episodes I-III barely touched the extended universe just as fan boy nods - the new ones can have this easily too.

The books are separate from the movies. The masses don't know what all happened in them anyway. We'll wish to see it on screen but I'm thrilled to see what they do.

In closing. They are doing fine with Marvel and Disney paid a billion dollars for Star Wars. A BILLION dollars. They won't mess this up. If they do well it's safe to say the mouse will be very upset.

Re:Worried I am not (1)

JWW (79176) | about 6 months ago | (#47050865)

Disney spent 4 BILLION for Star Wars.

Re:Worried I am not (2)

tekrat (242117) | about 6 months ago | (#47050909)

Lone Ranger / John Carter.
Worried I am.

It's Disney (2)

wbr1 (2538558) | about 6 months ago | (#47050625)

Jokes aside, Disney is one of the worst pushers of extended copyright and draconian content laws. I for one won't be giving them a dime of my money. If I want to see it, I know how I will.

Re:It's Disney (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050785)

Great! One less sweaty fat guy in the theater.

I liked Cloverfield (2)

kruach aum (1934852) | about 6 months ago | (#47050629)

I think a Star Wars/Cloverfield mash-up could be cool. The sith would set loose several huge Rancorrs on Coruscant to further the purposes of the dark side and then the jedi could carve them up and create buildings from the skin and bones that would grow on their own under the influence of the Light Side and turn Coruscant into a giant pulsating heart of Force. This would accidentally produce a tear in the Force and a new Chosen one would be born to restore balance. Twist: the one to bring balance to the Force is the first Rancorr able to become a Jedi. It mind-melds with the flesh-and-bone half of Coruscant and becomes a living planet capable of moving itself across the galaxy because of the number of Midi-chlorians it now commands, smashing itself into other worlds to absorb their life essences and drain Midi-chlorians from any Force sensitives.

Keep Uncle George far, far away... (2)

fallen1 (230220) | about 6 months ago | (#47050645)

George himself broke so much canon, or "retold" it, that it is not even funny. I've gone back and watched the original trilogy many times (I own them on laserdisc), to keep it fresh in memory so when I get into discussions about original vs prequels I'm not looking back with nostalgia.

Here is one great example:
Yoda: Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you? Hmm? Hmm. And well you should not. For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is. Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere, yes. Even between the land and the ship.

vs

Qui-Gon Jinn: Midi-chlorians are a microscopic life form that resides within all living cells.
and
Qui-Gon Jinn: Without the midi-chlorians, life could not exist, and we would have no knowledge of the Force. They continually speak to us, telling us the will of the Force. When you learn to quiet your mind, you'll hear them speaking to you.

Complete and total turn around. The Force is now administered through a third party to let the Jedi/Sith know what to do - the will of the Force? *gags* *pukes* That is exactly opposite of what Yoda tells Luke - in that LIFE creates the Force. Quo-Gon says without midi-chlorians life could not exist and that you must "hear" the midi-chlorians speak to you. If that was the case, why didn't Yoda explain that to Luke? Because it was some retconning bullshit Lucas came up with to give life to his god-complex character.

There are many, many other examples of complete "WTF?" moments between original and prequel.

time travel (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050647)

Seriously. Go back in time and prevent the release of the prequels. And also don't make VII.

You can't bring back the dead (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050653)

The Star Wars franchise, such as it still exists, has been run directly into the ground for an entire generation. Most kids growing up during this period never even saw any of the good Star Wars movies, and still haven't. The momentum behind this died years ago. Seriously, Episode VII could be the second coming of Joss Whedon and they still couldn't bring back the Star Wars glory days.

Stick a fork in it, for pity's sake.

Abrams already ruined Star Trek (3, Insightful)

Jody Bruchon (3404363) | about 6 months ago | (#47050661)

Why should we expect anything less for Star Wars? Fuck plot, let's move the camera so much that the audience gets motion sickness! BRIGHT LIGHTS! BIG EXPLOSIONS! VULCANS THAT HAS FEELS!

The vast majority of Hollywood movies have been shit ever since this thing happened. [slashdot.org] Independent and classic film both seem far superior, especially since they have generally made up for poor access to special effects with creativity in other areas. (Remember when special effects were, well, special?)

Abrams can't be worse (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050781)

George has already ruined Star Wars and Abrams can't actually do worse.

Remember in addition to the garbage prequels George made 2 Ewok movies and the Droids cartoon.

Re:Abrams can't be worse (1)

Jody Bruchon (3404363) | about 6 months ago | (#47050879)

Oh god. The memories.

Internet alcohol binge commencing.

Re:Abrams already ruined Star Trek (1)

Agares (1890982) | about 6 months ago | (#47050835)

I agree with you very much. I wish Star Wars and Star Trek were what they use to be.

What EP VII Needs... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050665)

is some grit. Sure, the whiz-bang crap is expected, but give the overall film some grit, ala Road Warrior. Make it a high-stakes edge-of-your-seat film, not some prancing teenage protagonists in metrosexual space clothes.

In the words of a great film... (1)

newcastlejon (1483695) | about 6 months ago | (#47050667)

"Let them die."

Jar Jar Hill (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | about 6 months ago | (#47050671)

Yay! [youtube.com]

Nothing (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050673)

They don't need to put the series back on track.
The series exists.
They just need to let it continue to exist.
We don't need more star wars movies. We already have 6.
They just need to let go and create some new IP instead of rehashing the same old shit.

product of its time (1)

epyT-R (613989) | about 6 months ago | (#47050683)

Like most things, star wars is a product of the culture at a particular time, so the further we get from that time period, the harder it is to recapture. It's sometimes possible to reinvent, but most times, the reinventions that actually do ok share little in common with the old. That's just the way it is. Lucas waited too long to flesh out the story and it shows.

I will still go see them. (1)

slugstone (307678) | about 6 months ago | (#47050699)

Because I have seem the other six in the theaters and I have watched a lot worst stuff. I will still try to enjoy them.

I long thought of an answer.... (1)

Brethil (1107807) | about 6 months ago | (#47050701)

I long thought of an answer.... and after careful consideration I can synthesize an appropriate answer: NO!

How to make money in film (1)

kalayq (827594) | about 6 months ago | (#47050709)

Step 1: Take series that people already have a connection to, getting around having to do so on your own.
Step 2: Get rid of everything but the basics of the storyline, including what people liked about the series in the first place.
Step 3: Try to reinvent the wheel using the same paint job of the original.
Step 4: Release the movies and hope that the fans connection to the previous movies will push them into seeing it, even though it gets bad reviews.
Step 5: Find new series, rinse and repeat.

Simple Answer: NO (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050717)

Sorry, but adding Disney to the mix will only mean hidden phallic symbols and scantily-clad teenaged actresses.

I am extremely excited about this! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050729)

.. because it will hopefully at least reduce the amount of soul killing damage that Abrams can do to Star Trek by keeping him preoccupied with SW.

The Return of Jar Jar Binks. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050757)

Star Wars Episode VII or as it will be commonly know - The Return of Jar Jar Binks.

George Lucas never had a full chance to smear lati (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050787)

We have racist jar jar (blacks). We have Asians who are good at building robots and evil. And we have jabba the hut for Jews.

Why Did... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050803)

Why did George Lucas cross the road?

To urinate on my childhood.

Why did J.J. Abrams cross the road?

To join Lucas in urinating on my childhood.

No. (2)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | about 6 months ago | (#47050825)

"Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny. Consume you it will."

Sanitized, not saved (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050837)

There's no question that Episode VII will be better than the prequel trilogy. This is guaranteed. Because Episode VII is going to be polished, focus tested to a sheen, and designed to alienate as few people as possible. That's the exact opposite of the prequel trilogy, which were designed in the vision of their author, George Lucas, and as a result alienated anyone who wasn't crazy. The budget and need for a return for shareholders guarantee this. The stewardship of the franchise by businesspersons rather than creatives will guarantee this. So yes, Episode VII will be a sanitized, safe, polished sequel. ... but will it be saved? No. Star Wars is a commercial property now. This is not a product being made for creative reasons, even if some people involved are happy to make it. There will be annual Star Wars releases now until the end of time. Which is fine, but none will be memorable or iconoclastic like the first two films were.

Anyone considering themselves a "Star Wars fan", rather than a fan of a few of the movies and some of the non-film content, is at this point crazy and basically submitting that they'll buy anything. It's so much bigger than that. Same is true of comic book fans: people who are fans of Marvel rather than fans of specific things Marvel have made are basically stamping "exploit me" on their forehead. Quality products should attract your attention, not products that happen to be made by companies that once upon a time made a quality product.

J.J. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47050939)

If Mr. Abrams has anything to do with it it will start really strong and end confused and unresolved. I will hold out the hope that it will be good but his track record is not filling me with confidence.

Just give us something new (1)

future assassin (639396) | about 6 months ago | (#47050949)

like something that has never been done before. I love the og Star Wars and all the Star Trek shows but I'm sick on the same lets "reboot" every 20 years bull shit that is happening.

GIVE US SOME NEW SCI-FI. I think The Matrix was the last show when you can really say WOW I'll be re-watching this for years to come. Yes there were plenty of other good sci-fi but nothing to keep talking about for 40 years.

It's all about the story.. (1)

NormHome (99305) | about 6 months ago | (#47050969)

There were some pretty terrible story elements in both Abrams Star Trek movies that made stories in TOS and TOS movies (as well as some of the other Star Trek series) sure to not happen in the new Abrams reality and some of the characters were acting very out of character since Trek fans know them like they were members of the family.

The problem is that Star Wars fans have been feasting on material that is now going to be thrown out and we will now have a new Star Wars reality, if the story is good and the characters true to the originals it may stand a chance of being good but if the story changes the original characters in ways the fans disapprove of it's not going to be well received by the traditionally minded.

Avoid medechlorians and jar-jar (2)

joe_frisch (1366229) | about 6 months ago | (#47050989)

Pretty easy:

1) avoid medechlorians, JarJar and Ewoks.

2) Avoid really stupid looking special effects

3). Avoid really bad dialog

4). Avoid truly stupid plots.

5). Avoid completely transparent toy marketing.

Then the movie will make a billion dollars, as will the next two. Its really not that hard.

Remove the restrictions on the scriptwriters. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 6 months ago | (#47051039)

At the moment, they are in the middle of an incredibly complex and boring process to try and make the Star Wars universe make sense.
Every idea will be scrutinised and analysed with respect to all the other films and thousand page style guides.

This is creative suicide.

Just allow the writers to have fun and write something enjoyable. It's fiction and doesn't need to always make sense.

Betteridge's Law of Headlines (1)

neminem (561346) | about 6 months ago | (#47051045)

It is crazy that that particular meme has not yet been posted, as this is a pretty clear example of where its invocation would be accurate.

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